Sara Ackerman

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Show notes

In this Aviatrix Writers’ Room interview with best-selling author Sara Ackerman, she shares how she went from three rejected, unpublished novels to finding an agent and becoming the successful author of six acclaimed historical fiction novels centered on Hawaiian history, including her latest release, The Uncharted Flight of Olivia West.

Transcript:

[00:00:00] Liz: Hello and welcome to the Aviatrix Writers Room. I’m Liz Booker and I’m continuing my conversation with author Sarah Ackerman about her new release, The Uncharted Flight of Olivia West.

Intro:

Fewer than 10 percent of pilots and aircraft mechanics are women. These are their stories of tenacity, adventure, and courage.

Stories with the power to inspire, heal, and connect. Welcome to the Literary Aviatrix community, where we leverage the power of story to build and celebrate our community and inspire the next generation of aviation.

Welcome back, Sarah.

[00:00:44] Sara: Thank you. I’m happy to be here.

[00:00:46] Liz: In the first portion of our interview, you mentioned that you came to writing and publishing in your 40s. What and that you had started with poetry, but what really put you over the edge? What jump started you and when did you decide to sit down and how’d you go about it?

[00:01:05] Sara: I think what happened was, so I had always been a teacher and a school counselor. I was an educator and I had shifted gears slightly and I was teaching. I went from teaching in the classroom. Then I taught online and the school that I was working at ended up shutting down. And so suddenly for the first time, I actually had time for myself to think, is this what I want to be doing?

And. It was one of those big pivotal moments. And I decided I was going to go to acupuncture school and it was a four year program. And so during that it was a night program though. And so I had a lot more time during the day and I just I don’t know exactly. I think I had done this whole little program or was a book that was like how to change your life kind of thing.

And, and then that motivated me to just start writing, and I have three unpublished novels before my first published book. And I was going to writers conferences and just writing a lot, reading books on writing. And then my fourth book got me an agent.

[00:02:13] Liz: Wow! So you wrote four novels before you were able to nail down an agent.

[00:02:22] Sara: Yeah. And I had for that one that got me the agent, I had sent it out a bit, not getting any bites. And then I hired a freelance editor and she helped me just take it up a notch.

[00:02:34] Liz: Yeah. And that was the thing that put it, put you over the edge, you think? So what was that process for you?

How did you find your agent?

[00:02:42] Sara: Just through regular old querying. Yep. I sent out, I had sent out hundreds in the past my previous three books and I had met a couple of agents at writers conferences, but nothing ever came to that came from that. And so I was discouraged rejection, rejection, rejection.

And then I was – they always say you’re at that point where you’re about to quit. And then I got a email. Like from my agent, or actually it was the head of the agency. And she’s Oh my gosh, we love your book. We were reading it out loud. And I was just like, Oh my gosh,

[00:03:17] Liz: Look at you now, look at you now.

[00:03:21] Sara: So yeah, I have that email, like my mom was so cute. She framed it. I still have a letter that, you know.

[00:03:29] Liz: Yeah, that’s an important one to keep. Congratulations. What do you think set you apart to keep pushing because there are so many writers who would not have the tenacity to get, you know, rejection after rejection.

And like you said, be at the point of quitting and then keep going,

[00:03:47] Sara: You know, I just I had also, I think, as part of that whole little life changing book and pivot that I did, I was journaling, like my thankful journal every day. And I was just really, visioning it and determined that this is what was going to happen.

There’s no other option. It’s it has to happen at some point.

[00:04:10] Liz: You made your dreams come true. That’s amazing. That’s amazing. And okay, so you made your dreams come true. How has it changed your life?

[00:04:17] Sara: It’s been incredible. It’s that first book when it you hold in your hands, it feels very surreal and very exciting.

 It’s quite a roller coaster. It’s definitely a roller coaster just because you have an agent doesn’t mean you have it made. Just because you have a book, one book doesn’t mean you have it made. With every book, it’s a struggle and starting over and hoping that and then are people gonna want to read it and buy it and So there’s a fair amount of pressure and all that but I just love the writing and it’s so much fun And it’s yeah a lot of ups and a lot of downs as well.

[00:04:59] Liz:

What do you struggle most with in your writing?

[00:05:26] Sara: You know early on I had I read that there was there’s that kind of line about never stop writing at the end of a scene, always stop mid scene. And that totally has saved me from writer’s block. Because I always have a point to jump in when you start the next day.

So I wouldn’t say writer’s block. I think it’s just the discipline of just sitting down and writing every day. I wouldn’t say I struggle with it you have to really stay on top of yourself to manage your time.

[00:05:42] Liz: Yeah, I love that you include on your website just a little blurb about your process and how you go about things.

And I saw that you like to write about 700 to a thousand words, and it takes three to four months for you to finish a manuscript. Those are all really interesting to hear from a working author who has published as many books as you have to understand what that process looks like for somebody who is very consistent and disciplined about it.

So thank you for putting that out there.

[00:06:10] Sara: This one, I’m like 900 words a day and then 500 like weekdays and then 500 on the weekend, like words. Oh yeah. That’s a little break.

[00:06:21] Liz: Yeah. And do you write linearly like through the story or do you hop around? Are you a plotter or a pantser? What do you do?

[00:06:27] Sara: In the beginning, I was a total pantser just Oh, I’m right this and then it becomes hard later on when you encounter things You realize, Oh no, I, how am I going to work through this?

And then with a publisher, you really need to plot it out for them. You have to turn in that like 10 page synopsis and, but knowing that it can change and they know it can change, so you don’t have to stick to it, but I found it really helps. And new things always arise anyway, and you’re surprised yourself.

But yeah, I’m. I’ve become a plotter. And then with the with the dual timeline, I write the first storyline first, because I know some authors say they’ll write one and they’ll switch. Yeah. But I’m like I need to know what happens in that whole storyline before I can write a later storyline.

[00:07:17] Liz: I feel like I would need to be that way too. Yeah, I think Kate Quinn was one who she like, writes it as she goes, but yeah, I don’t, I would need to. Have a clear picture of what’s going on. Yeah, that’s really interesting. What’s your relationship? Like when you have a finished manuscript, how do you know it’s finished?

First of all, like, when do you know it’s time to send it off to your agent? And is your agent and developmental right? Does she help you with the writing or? Yeah.

[00:07:48] Sara: I think it’s it’s because with a deadline, I’m like, it has to be good enough now but once I finish it, then I put it aside, I would like to put it aside for longer, but I have to get it in.

So I put aside for maybe a weekend or something, then I read through it and realize it’s not the greatest book ever written and it needs a lot of work. And so I’ll just just fixing like sentences and making things sound smoother and then I’ll turn it in to my agent, who is really a great editor as well.

She gives me just a lot of really good feedback on bigger picture story ideas. And then probably work on it for a few weeks. Two or three weeks. I’d like to have longer, but I don’t. And then I give it to my editor, who I have a new editor, so I had the first editor for five books. And then Olivia West a new editor, cause my editor left.

And so it’s different. It’s just getting used to a new editor. She’s great as well. And then a few back and forth. So I’ll send it to her a month and a half, and then send it to her. And then I just got back edits last night.

[00:09:06] Liz: Have you ever run into a place where the editor thinks one thing or your agent thinks one thing and you think another?

And do you feel like You, you want to dig in on it? Like, how do you navigate those moments?

[00:09:18] Sara: Sometimes there’s usually things, one or two, nothing major usually, and we’re usually always able to work through it. I just know they always make the book so much better. They make it so much better. They really push you and they also give you suggestions.

Cause sometimes I’m like I know I want to get to this point, but I don’t know what to do. You’re so close to it. You can’t tell. And they’re like, Oh, put this here or. You need to add more of this and it’s just, it’s so much better after they get a hold of it.

[00:09:49] Liz: So what’s the one piece of advice that you wish you’d gotten when you were starting out?

[00:09:56] Sara: Gosh, I don’t know. Honestly that’s a hard one. I feel like I had I feel like you just have to go through the process on your own and figure out what works for you I had all this advice, all these books, and it’s just gonna, it’s a process and it’s not a fast, it’s, you can’t expect it to happen overnight it took me I think five or six, five years of writing before I got an agent.

And then here I am, 11 years after when I started writing and I’m still just learning so much and, but I feel like I’ve figured out a process by now.

[00:10:45] Liz: That’s wonderful. Of all of the accolades and prizes and all of the things that you received. What is your proudest moment?

[00:10:57] Sara: Oh, my goodness.

That is hard, too. I think the thing that always affects me the most is when people send me emails and they tell me my grandfather was at Pearl Harbor. My uncle was like at Guadalcanal. Just these people with their—it seems like everyone has a connection to World War II somewhere in their family.

Especially in the Pacific. And just to hear from these people. It’s pretty incredible. And they thank me for helping them understand what their family members lived through. So that is really, I think, probably the most rewarding.

[00:11:41] Liz: Yeah, it’s great. I think everybody comes at history from a different angle and has to find a way that works for them.

And I talk a lot on these interviews about how this project has helped me get into history from the perspective of women pilots in ways that I didn’t identify or couldn’t really get excited about reading before because I didn’t really identify with the characters. And so it’s fun to have historical fiction where you can get drawn in by the character emotionally and follow them.

And then as you go, learn about what people really experienced then. So that’s a beautiful craft that you and a service that you provide us to preserve that history.

[00:12:28] Sara: You’re right. You’re right. The emotional part, because when I was in school, I was a terrible history student. I did not do well in history.

I really struggled with it. And but yeah, when I read, when they gave us novels, I was like, Oh my gosh, I love this. And so that, yeah, it makes such a big difference for so many people.

[00:12:48] Liz: Yeah. For so many people. Some people love the history and they want the facts and they want like the details I get that.

That’s a different kind of reader, but in order to make it help it resonate with a broader audience, it’s nice to have other ways in. So you provide us a doorway in.

What do you envision are your big author dreams?

[00:13:14] Sara: I just would love for my books to just gain a bigger, broader audience. The historical World War II is, you know, it’s definitely It’s just not As broad as I guess I would like it to be, and I think it’s hard with publishers as well.

They have so many books that are put out these days. There’s just so many books. And so it’s really hard to stand out. And you don’t have a lot of control over how much your publisher’s promoting it and getting out there and stuff. That and I would love, of course, probably most authors want to see their books as movies.

I just think that these they’re so cinematic. And there’s so many World War II movies that are very battle centric, very male centric. And I think these stories are so amazing about the women and the people in Hawaii, like that were at ground zero living here, living through it. That would be cool to see on film.

[00:14:28] Liz: Yeah. I agree.

I want to see, I want to see movies that feature women in our history for sure. Absolutely.

I’m going to, I’m going to speak heresy right now. Do you have to, based on what you just said. Do you ever see a time where you maybe pursue publishing on your own?

[00:14:45] Sara: I’ve thought about it because like I said, I have those three books that are not published. And then I wrote a book in between, stuck one in there that is not published. We shot that one around, I think in 2020 and didn’t get picked up and I just love it. And I also have a book on writing that I wrote 10 Steps on How to Write a Novel that I think is super helpful. And so I think I would think about self-publishing any of those.

My early ones really need a lot of work though. And the writing, I love the stories, but the writing needs a lot of work and I just, I don’t have time. So that would be my big struggle is when am I going to find the time to do that. But sometimes I think about it because I love stories and if a publisher isn’t going to put them out there, then maybe someday I will.

[00:15:41] Liz: That’s amazing.

Did your grandparents ever get to read any of your books?

[00:15:47] Sara: No, I wish my grandparents, my grandmother would have loved to know that. She was such a good storyteller and she just was, she just always talked about the war. It never was far from their minds, even 30 years later, because it was just such a pivotal, huge part of their life. And there was so much darkness and fear, but there was also a lot of connection and she spoke about it with this nostalgia. So no, she was, they died younger. My parents both read my first—my dad died right after my first book came out. And so he did get to read it.

And then my mom passed away last year. So she. She read a few of them, and they were just my biggest fans.

[00:16:44] Liz: Aw, that’s lovely. It’s wonderful you had that support. Sarah, is there anything else that you wanted to share about writing? Any other wisdom you want to drop for our aspiring writers?

[00:16:56] Sara: I think, like we’ve talked about, it’s just a matter of really sticking with it if you love it, sticking with it, but also be willing, really willing to accept help and accept feedback.  I really found that going to conferences was really helpful for me

[00:17:18] Liz: In what way get did you pay for a manuscript reads?

Did you have critique groups? What happened?

[00:17:26] Sara: No, I just met with agents, but just in terms of all the workshops and reading and hearing other people’s stuff critiqued and your stuff critiqued. Nowadays it’s easier I think to find critique partners online and that kind of thing. If you can’t afford a conference, definitely, I would say do that.

[00:17:44] Liz: Yeah, for sure.

Sara, it’s been wonderful talking with you. We appreciate everything that you’ve done for again for our community by bringing a female pilot into your story. And for sharing your wisdom about writing and you’re like, your discipline is absolutely inspiring. And I needed, I need to be inspired at this moment because I’m a little stuck.

So just getting to talk to you really gets me charged up. And I’m like, you know what? I can do a thousand words a day. That’s usually my goal too. So I just need to get on with it. Definitely.

[00:18:18] Sara: And a lot of times I’m just like, oh, this is not that interesting. This is so not interesting as I’m writing it and, but I think it’s not surprising to us as we’re writing it because we already know it.

And but it is interesting. It just doesn’t feel that way at the time and you can always rework it later too so, as long as you get those words out, I think you’re on the right track.

[00:18:43] Liz: Yeah. Thank you. I cannot wait to read your new book, The Uncharted Flight of Olivia West and your other historical novels, because they all sound really fun and fascinating.

And I look forward to your next works that come out. Sara, where can we find you? Just remind us here in the Writer’s Room.

[00:19:02] Sara: Oh on Instagram, that’s probably my most active there, Sarah Ackerman Books, and Facebook, Ackerman books. And then my website is ackermanbooksaswell. com.

[00:19:14] Liz: Great. All the best with the book launch.

[00:19:18] Sara: much. It was great talking to you. Thanks so

[00:19:21] Liz: Thank you so much for listening. I’d like to thank Michael Wilds of Massif and Kroo for his support of all things literary aviatrix and for his support of several of our authors with various services tailored to their needs. Massif and Kroo is empowering voices, building brands, and shaping cultures.

If you need any assistance in your author needs, I highly recommend his support.